A 7 figure business on 10 hours a week? Yes please with Leonie Dawson

Transcript

* Transcript created by AI – may contain errors or omissions from original podcast audio

CLARE: Today on the Clare Wood Podcast, I have a special treat for you. Today I am interviewing Leonie Dawson, who has managed to build her seven figure business, working only 10 hours a week and doing this as a neurodivergent person. I personally invested in Leonie’s course work less, earn more. And you’ll hear us talk about this in the episode.

I am a proud affiliate for this course. So if you have a listen to this episode and think that course sounds amazing, particularly for that price point, jump on into the link in the show notes for today’s episode, and make sure that you sign up because I personally had so many aha moments working through it, but with no further ado, let’s get started.

Let’s get started on the interview and I hope you enjoyed listening as much as I enjoyed recording this episode. There were lots of giggles.

 Leonie, this is so wonderful to have you on the podcast.

LEONIE: I just like love that we get the opportunity just to sit and have a chat and a tea with each other. I’ve actually got a cup of tea here too. Oh my we’re twins. My teacup matches your shirt. We’re twinning, twinning already.

CLARE: Well, it’s yeah, it’s awesome to have you come on and have a bit of a chin wag. And it’s really appropriate timing because I have recently done your course work less, earn more. And did I say that right? It’s not earn more, work less, is it? No. Perfect. And I have just been absolutely lapping up the content.

So it’s fantastic timing to have you here on the podcast today. Before I ramble on anymore, cause I have a tendency to do that. Can I get you to introduce yourself to the listeners who maybe haven’t heard of you yet?

LEONIE: Sure. I’m super rubbish at introducing myself. Whenever a doctor or anything asks me what I do, I just say, I just talk shit on the internet. Just, just, that’s, that’s my job. I’ve been in the online world for Nearly 20 years now. It just feels like this enormously joyful creative experiment. I written gold workbooks that people use for their businesses and their lives. And they like do it every single year and like half a million people have used them worldwide now. I just like making things like rainbow and unicorns and sparkly and fun. And then I also teach a whole lot of courses about business and marketing and doing business differently and doing business as a neurodivergent person. person and whatever else I get excited by really.

CLARE: Amazing. Would you want to explain what you mean by being a neurodivergent person?

LEONIE: Sure. I am somebody who has autism and ADHD, the special combination and anyone who is neurodivergent it can encompass a whole bunch, just somebody who’s just a neurotypical person. You know, you may have mental illnesses or you may have dyslexia or just any of like the neurospicy categories going on.

CLARE: Wonderful. So I’m pretty new into your world and one of the things that I have observed about you online is you’re a bit of a rule breaker. How does that sit? If I say that to you, do you go what? Or do you go, yeah, I kind of am.

LEONIE: It’s I just didn’t realize there was rules to follow. And I’m like, Oh God, what do I do to break the rules? But I really just try and do something that feels right to me. And when I try and do something a different, way, sometimes it just doesn’t feel good at all. So I just don’t. So I’m very conscious about following my own path, working out what my strengths and my weaknesses are, building my business around that and accidentally along the way, I guess I’ve broken some rules.

CLARE: Well, it’s funny because I think this is one of the things that I’m really excited to dive into, you’ve built a wildly successful business. And the very first time I heard about you was Denise Duffield Thomas was talking about this person that built this successful, you know, seven figure business without being on social media. And I’m like, what is that possible in the online world? How does someone run an online business without being on social media? And that was the first time. And I was like, wow. Wow. So do you want to talk to me about like, how did you even get to the point where you were like, I’m not going to go on social media?

LEONIE: Yeah. You know, it was I didn’t expect it to come. It had sort of been building and building. I thought I would take 21 days off it just as an experiment to, to try it out. And really quickly realized like, Oh no, at this point in my life, It needs to be a long term thing. I thought I would give it three months for my business to see how it would go without it. And when I looked at my statistics for me personally, the vast majority of my sales were coming from my mailing list, which is something that I’ve really cultivated and worked on for a long, long time. And, you know, creating blogs and things like that. That’s my main form of creation and connection. And I only was getting like 20 percent of my sales from social media. And for me at that point in my business, I was like, well, I could probably give up 20%, of those sales, especially if it means it opens up my time to try and market in a different way.

So I ended up taking two years off social media. I’d still brought in over 2 million during that time. And I did not expect at all to go back. I had no intention. It wasn’t kind of a marketing thing. I just at the start of this year realized I was chafing against my own creative rule because I wanted to make some stupid videos. And I thought social media is probably a good place to like Share those. And I don’t want to keep restraining myself from trying out different creative mediums. So I back on social media, but in a very contained and constrained way. Like, I actually don’t really look at social media myself. I don’t access it on a daily basis. I just create content into a library that gets recycled, basically.

CLARE: That TikTok video that you sent through in the group chat the other day, I literally nearly peed my pants laughing. Honestly, you have to go and check out TikTok because if that is what the content is like, it is highly entertaining.

LEONIE: It makes me laugh as well because we just had a new team member like on board at UVA and my assistant to get her up to speed with who I am and how I present in the world sent her that TikTok video. I assume it’s the one of me being a cavewoman, picking my own nose. Yeah. And yeah, but my new staff member was like, Oh, this is perfect.

CLARE: I love that. That’s fantastic. And I can actually relate to both sides of the coin of what you’re talking about. You know, I, a lot of my business is through social media but I can also empathize with really like feeling like it’s zapping a lot of your, Energy and time. And then the flip side of that, I’ve said, right, I’m taking off a month and then I miss it so much. Like I miss creating, I miss sharing stories with my audience. So I end up people like, I thought you were taking a break. And I’m like, well, I was, but then I wanted to share this. And then I want to share this. So I appreciate what it’s like on, on both sides of the coin there. That was one of the. The, the inverted commas rules that, you know, I’d heard about you breaking it.

And then when I joined your course, I was like, she’s not on camera and I’ve done a lot of courses and I’ve never seen someone not do that. You know, the tiny little image that’s up in the corner. And it’s funny cause when I did my recent course, I was really, really unwell. I got this like cold, I didn’t even know what it was. It lasted for like nine weeks, but basically the entire time I’m recording, I’m like, and then having to pause the recording. And, and I was like, why do I have to be on camera? I feel like crap, but I’m like, but that’s just what everyone does. So I just fell into line, like, you know, a lemmings falling off the edge of a cliff. And when I came into your course, I was like, this is so empowering to realize. That you don’t have to do that just because everyone else does it.

LEONIE: No. And like, you know, for me, it wasn’t even really a conscious thing. It just said sometimes when I create courses, like it’s always at different times of the day and some of it’s like, middle of the night. Like if, like, it’s just whenever that creative flow comes. And like, it’s going to be very hard for me to film with that. And I also want to create like as much creativity in a slide deck as well so that people don’t really notice that I’m not there. My face is very visible in other parts of my business. And I was also inspired by our friend Lizzie Goddard. And Lizzie doesn’t have her video, her face on video either. And she’s like, yeah. And people kind of don’t even notice because I see my face everywhere else. So yeah, it’s been, it’s, that’s just what I do because it’s the only way I can create without getting my head stuck up my own asshole.

CLARE: And you are a very creative and talented artist as well. Again, like looking at your slides, I am so envious. I’m one of those that give me a spreadsheet and I’m like, I’m in heaven. Give me pen and paper. I, and I look at your drawings and think, wow, that is so cool. Again, such a different way of presenting content visually that people can appreciate, recognize, and go, I love a good drawing. So I really love that as well.

LEONIE: Oh, bless you. It’s just, honestly, it’s just what makes me feel joyful and it’s how my brain takes that information as well. I tend to visualize everything in words and pictures. And so everything I create usually is some combination of those.

CLARE: How cool. How awesome. Another big rule, sorry, I feel like I’m just like going, these are all the rules you’re breaking, is that you only work. 10 hours a week. Is this right? Yeah.

LEONIE: And it’s so funny when people are like, Oh my God. I saw it’s revolutionary. There was a book that was written called the four hour work week because, because I am autistic. I am very literal. So I read that and I was like, wow. Okay. Four hours a week. I think I could do it in 10. And so I just sort of built my business around that. And I also, I’ve never had the luxury of working full time in my business. So when I was starting my business, I worked full time for the Australian government and I stayed working there until I was earning six figures from my side business.

So I really only had 10 hours a week or less to build the business. And I only left it, the public service when I had a baby and that baby did not sleep. And so to even get 10 hours a week was a luxury. I also just wanted to be super present. I wanted to exclusively breastfeed all that kind of hippie garbage. And so I had to create a way for my business to make money in the corners of my life. It doesn’t take up the whole of my life. It takes up like the, just the corners. And it always feels like a really good fit to me. And so we, you know, I was able to homeschool my kids for three years before the pandemic even started. They’re at school now, but even, even then I just, I don’t have the time or the inclination to work more than that. Plus, I have this back condition where my bones dislocate if I sit in a position for too long. It’s, it’s a real drag. So 10 hours a week is a good fit for me. And sometimes it’s a little bit more and then sometimes it’s like none.

CLARE: So, you mean you don’t work at all some weeks?

LEONIE: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I took like four months off last, last week. Yeah. Yeah. I think.

CLARE: Wow. Okay. This is like mind blowing. I am loving, loving, loving hearing this and I’m sure it’ll be inspiring so many people as well. Isn’t it crazy how we just make up all of these rules that like, I don’t even know where this stuff came in great from me on, except for like following what other people are doing.

LEONIE: Yeah. And I just like, just some things don’t work for me. And then when I saw the Tim Ferriss stuff back in 2007, I was like, Oh, that works for me. That actually works really well for my life goals. So I’ll just follow that.

CLARE: Oh, so cool. So have you seen, like, there was never really a point in time, I guess, where you sort of hit the brakes and went, okay, this is the way, that’s always been the way that you’ve built your business.

LEONIE: Yeah. Yeah. I, also had to make money, you know, when I left the public service, I got my husband to leave it with me so that we can move to like the tropical North Queensland, where I knew that neither of us would be able to get jobs. And so I was like, right, well, this money, this business still needs to make a lot of money to, for us to live off and support our family, but I also need to have my boobs out constantly. So let’s work out a way …

CLARE: I mean mean that would’ve been one way to make some money, .

 Okay, let’s, let’s talk a little bit about money. So when you said, there’s obviously levels of… we need to, you know, afford groceries and things like that. And we need to pay the electricity bill. Did you ever make a conscious decision, you know, as, as a multiple seven figure business owner, did you say, well, that is something that’s important to me or how did that kind of evolution happen in your own business journey?

LEONIE: Yeah, it was, it wasn’t my original starting desire whatsoever. It was like, could I even possibly have a business doing these things that I really enjoy doing and just being a creative? And then it was like, right, would I be able to have a business that could support both me and my husband so that we could have kids and not, you know, send them off to daycare and things like that. We just wanted to be together. And then as, you know, I unlocked that, I was like, huh, okay, well, let’s see, How much more I could bring it? Let’s just try that. And it’s not by pushing, like, putting more hours in or hiring more staff because I like to have a very, very small team. But like, how far can I make this grow?

And at a certain point in time, you know, as you. grow older, like in your thirties, you start thinking about like, Oh, okay. What is my retirement plan? What I need to be at for that? Also, whatever, what happens if something happens to me because my family’s depended on my income, what do I need to do to create enough, enough assets and resources that no matter what happens, my people are taken care of.

So for me, the intention is really about just, you know, Taking great care of my people and also then looking at future dreams as well in terms of like, you know, eventually we would like to be able to do sort of, you know, luxury international travel. Or, you know, and have, you know, just invest more in holidays and experiences because we, we’re pretty, we kind of cheapskates with ourselves. So I’ll need to like increase the amount that I earn in order to feel comfortable with that amount of overflow because I like to save like at least 50 percent of my income.

CLARE: Wow.. That’s impressive savings goals. Yeah. I’m probably the opposite. My husband and I love to travel. Like it is our big thing that we do all the time going overseas. But you know, then we’re also at the point where we’re like, we probably don’t need to if we want to build this house, we probably need to be putting some more money aside and having less experiences in the short term, or alternatively, maybe we just need to earn more money.

LEONIE: Yeah, it’s just different seasons, right? And yeah. Five years ago when my kids were younger, I did not want to travel at all because I thought like I would rather stab myself in the face with a cucumber than travel with small children. And now that are really cool age .

CLARE: I took my little one. He was just under two. I remember we’re trying to squeeze in the last, just under two overseas flight. And I was like, I will never travel with my children again. And now they’ve reached an age, you know, they’re five and eight where it’s actually really enjoyable to travel with them again. But yeah, I can totally relate to the stabbing in the eye with a cucumber comment. So for you, it’s been a lot about, not about the money, but about what money can deliver for you and your family.

LEONIE: Yeah, big time. And just being able to have the freedom and the spaciousness to take care of them. And also for it not to be a principal concern for us. Like I don’t want it to be a stressful thing. I don’t like, I always want my husband to feel very safe and secure in his decision to support me as the principal, the entrepreneur of the family. So yeah, it’s, it’s about those relationships and nurturing them and making sure that we’ve got the resources to support them.

CLARE: Have you ever experienced guilt around your relationship with working hours and your desire to earn more?

LEONIE: No.

CLARE: Has there not been a period of time where perhaps your business is stagnated or perhaps even gone backwards? Like maybe you’ve gone through a challenging financial time and then you’re like, oh my gosh, like, do I need to hustle a bit harder to, you Earn more through this period of time or, or has your business been a pretty solid machine throughout your life?

LEONIE: Like there’s definitely like, like up and down periods, like, you know, like there’s bigger flow times and things like that. We’ve, you know, it’s on average since 2000, we’ve, we’ve had seven figure years on average every year since 2014. So nearly out of a decade on, which is amazing and very high profit margins because that’s the way I like it. Yeah. For me, when I want to earn more money, it doesn’t occur to me to work more. What my intention is like, Oh, what is it wants to be created next in order to bring that through? What is the energy I need to step into in order to bring that through? What’s the different tactic I could try? And I think of it like almost like holographic expansion. Like how can I be strategic, follow Pareto’s principle of what 20 percent can create 80 percent of revenue. Where can I focus my efforts better in order to create growth? I am not interested in doing all the things. I am not interested in working a 40 hour week. Like that is, I don’t, I don’t think I’ve ever done 40 hours a week in my business ever.

 You know, just like a momentary week or anything. Even moving up to 20 hours a week. I just, I can’t be arsed. But I want to be smart with my energy and powerful with my energy to create growth.

CLARE: Has this been something that’s always been in you or have you been on like a money mindset journey or an internal like spiritual journey that’s got you to this way of thinking this this beautiful, like flowy way of thinking about money.

LEONIE: It’s definitely been a journey. I think like my experience with creativity is, has stayed the same in terms of like, it is fun and it is joyful and it is flow and whatever ideas want to come through me, I love it. Like it’s always been in right relationship. I used to be much more stuck around how money would flow through in those ways and so part of it was working on the practical stuff. So when I was in my mid twenties, Scott Pate brought out the Barefoot Investor the first, like the first, very first time a billion years ago. And my husband and I actually studied it and like implemented it and we were like not great with money at that point, you know, we’re just kind of like paycheck to paycheck, max out credit cards, the usual bullshit. And that totally gave us a real focus on getting there and being much more responsible and intentional with money. And I like to say, you know, in terms of like Denise Duffield Thomas talks about soulful money archetypes, my husband and I weren’t natural born accumulators. It was a choice that we made together to develop those habits. And then as I developed the money mindset habits, And my business and marketing skills, like I had to strengthen those in order for me to use my creations to bring in abundance for the business to be like a vessel to take my creativity out in the world and to receive abundance for it. So those, those things worked hand in hand so that now it does become more like creativity. It’s more about flow.

CLARE: I love that. Well, see, I’ve got a natural, like, natural masculine tendency, for me, it’s like, you want to make more, you work harder, you put more numbers in the spreadsheet and I have to learn this skill of, of flow and energy. And that’s why I’ve really leaned into a lot of mentors , I’ve been really challenged. I saw a psychic yesterday and he’s like, you need to just be still and be quiet. And I’m like, I’m not going to make more money when I’m being still, am I? Really fighting against that internal resistance to step into that space. So I love that. That is something that is really inherent and natural for you, but equally, you’ve also identified the need to go and learn the other side, which is, you know, the practical sides of, of growing a business and managing finances and, and things like that.

So let’s talk about the future. Looking forward. You’ve said that international luxury travel is on the agenda for you. Talk to me about that.

LEONIE: Ooh, I think it’s just wherever the family feels connected to. I think Japan will probably be the first place on our list. Of course, New Zealand, because it’s so close and we still haven’t been, which is ridiculous. Like we’ve been to India and we’ve been to Malaysia and Singapore, but yeah, we haven’t done any other countries. I’ve never been to America, but, I don’t really have any intention to go there. But I’m very keen to go to England and Denmark, which is my kind of like ancestral homelands you know, from many generations ago. But now that I’m turned midlife, there’s this real deep call in me to like walk the land that my ancestors have walked. So that would be amazing. I like kind of slow travel. So if I could just go to one place and just stay there for a couple of weeks or a month, that would be, that would be my jam.

CLARE: Amazing. So for you, what, and what else does like the future look like when you think about the next 10, 20 years for yourself and your business? What else are you excited about?

LEONIE: For me, first and foremost, it’s still like centered on, okay, what’s my family going to be like? The dynamic. You know, I’ve got six more years with my eldest kid before they’re an adult and that dynamic will change. And I just want to be present and I want to usher them through those years, just in a connected kind of loving way and become even more of myself in that process. I want to continue deepening my relationship with my husband. And I love that in long term partnerships, my husband and I have been together for 22 years. You develop even more grace with each other. And it just like, the well deepens. It’s, it’s this fascinating energy and it’s, you know, it’s difficult at some times because you’re up against your own limits. But I’m excited to see what that brings out in me and I’m excited to see what next evolution of myself is coming and what wants to be created as part of that process. Like, I don’t know what I’m going to make next. I don’t have any plans and I don’t have any plans for my business except for the fact that I just want to keep turning up and sharing and creating and making things and helping people in whatever ways I’m called to.

CLARE: That’s so cool. Is that sort of been the formula with a lot of the programs that you’ve created in the past?

LEONIE: Yeah. Yeah. I, I never really plan what’s going to happen next. I’ll just get an idea and then the next week I’ll launch it in the world. Well, it’s just like, as much as I’m a free flowing hippie, I have like the, cause I’ve been doing it for so long, I get to that number because I’ve got a spreadsheet that tells me you know, this is about on average what you’ll earn from a new product or whatever. And I mean, some of them will be complete flops and I might earn like, Hey, I’ve had $20, 000. Don’t worry. The multimillionaire will be fine, but I’m like, Oh my God. But like, you just don’t know what’s going to land amazingly and what’s going to be like the next flop or the next value. You just have to keep turning up and sharing and putting it out there anyway.

CLARE: What’s been the hardest time you’ve gone through as a business owner?

LEONIE: Ooh. For me you know, my business was growing really fast. And at that time I was self printing the goals workbooks and we were printing them in China. Then they were going on three different boats across the world into different countries, into the distribution centers. And then we would need all the staff to manage that process and respond to all the customer service emails while like 80, 000 packages get sent out in the space of like two or three months. It was freaking hectic. And so I ended up with a staff of like 20, 25 plus, and you know, the print bill was like half a million dollars a year for that. I just felt like that was what I had to do, like, to cope with the business growth. And in doing so, I discovered I actually really hate having a large team. I hate managing staff and the more staff you have, the more you have to work because the more management you have to do. And it’s just the less creative time I had, it was amazing because I even had to start, this is so horrific. Like, I had to start blocking out times in my weekend where I could do my creative work because my work week was just chock a block with with meetings or with managing the next, like, logistical fire that had happened.

And so I was like, this sucks, my creative job is once again relegated to the weekend. Like I’ve got a normal freaking job. And as an autistic person, I just don’t understand a lot of people. I only understand, like really innately understand other neurodivergent people. And so working with a whole bunch of neurotypicals was not good for me. It was heartbreaking and completely devastating. And so I made the decision with my husband that we would right size the business over the space of a couple of years and just reduce it back, streamline it back, be very, you know, clear about what was our core business, what wasn’t getting rid of, getting rid of a whole bunch of stuff and tasks that weren’t needed to be doing. We outsourced bits and we didn’t replace people when they left. We had to let go of some staff who weren’t performing. It was a shit show. But getting back to a place where I have one part time assistant to run a seven figure business is perfect, chef’s kiss. It was just extraordinarily difficult to realize that and know that for myself.

CLARE: The course that I invested in with you is, was that a really accessible price point? It was a US a hundred dollars. I think around that mark, it certainly wasn’t a significant investment. How do you not end up with a whole bunch of customer services challenges. I personally have found in my business that the more I charge people, the less of a pain in the bum they are. And then the lower end products seem to require a lot of admin, a lot of handholding, a lot of that. Have you experienced that in your business?

LEONIE: No. But I know that that is a very, very common thing. We have about 10, 000 students in all of my courses and they’re all very low price point. And my customer service person works maybe three hours a week on our emails. And I have, you know, 50, 000 people on my mailing list and what I do is I try to pre answer questions as much as possible. So if we get a question asked more than once, we look at like, oh, where can we fill the, the, the information hole? So we are definitely like, we consider the idea that No customer service is the best customer service of all in terms of like if you have to give customer service, that’s because there’s a hole in the communication. Whereas if we preemptively answer people’s questions, if we guide them through processes with with videos, with FAQs, with the information they need at the right time, then they don’t need to email us. So that’s, that’s how we work through that part of the business.

CLARE: Yeah. Amazing. So if there are neuro divergent people listening to this episode and they, you know, are wondering if you’ve got any advice for, specifically people with ADHD or autism, is there any tips that you have for, for people running a business?

LEONIE: Yeah, absolutely. First and foremost, like, I want you to know that like, congratulations, you have the entrepreneur’s brain. You’ve done it. You’ve nailed it. Like, this is actually like a fantastic brain to have for success. When they looked at the CEOs of like, you know, the top 500 growing companies at least 70 percent of them have ADHD symptoms. It is called the Entrepreneur’s Disorder. It’s not really a disorder. It’s just a way that your brain functions. Your brain is able to see patterns and faster way of doing things. And you might find like me, you accidentally break some rules because you just thought, Well, I see that happening and that’s sort of stupid or I don’t like that, so I’ll do it differently and along the way you tend to innovate and create new paradigms and things like that. So it’s super exciting.

And for me, I think about all of the ways that I have strengths with my gifts. And then I also work on ways on supporting my weaknesses. So for me I don’t do in person stuff very often. I don’t do any one on one stuff. I don’t do one to one coaching. Because for me, it’s, it’s very depleting and takes a huge amount of brain energy to do it. And so what I much prefer is creating courses and books that I record and go on to serve, you know, tens of thousands of people, instead of me having to say the same fricking thing over and over again, while pretending to be normal. I also, I only hire Neurodivergent people now because I prefer people who are super blunt and they’re compassionate and they’re wildly empathetic, but they cannot lie to freaking save themselves. And they’ve got a very, like, just a logical way of seeing things that lines up with mine. So I drive neurotypical people crazy when they work for me. They drive me crazy. So just best just to just slot that out of the way. I’m going to stick with my neurodivergent people. I also feel completely fine with making that decision in that way because neurodivergent people can be underemployed. It’s just that me as a neurodivergent person, I know what gifts we have and I know how to manage people like me. So that works really well for me.

And I just say no to a whole bunch of things. There’s a lot of things that I don’t do that are typical business and I just don’t do it because it’s not my jam or it’ll make me want to stab myself in the face with another kind of vegetable that’s not a cucumber. Like probably a pumpkin. I don’t know. Maybe a harder one.

CLARE: @ Amazing. Well, thank you for all of those tips. And yeah, I’ve heard the stat 80 percent of female entrepreneurs have ADHD. So that sort of lines up. A lot of my clients come to me and say, you know, I need to tell you about something before we start working together. I’m like, dude, like we’re all in this together. I don’t have a diagnosis, but you know, I’ve been told by enough people that you know, the signs are probably there. Let’s be honest.

One last thing that I really wanted to dig into with you was about you know, if people are listening to this, like me and sitting here, just being like my mind’s being blown, but I kind of feel stuck into how to actually shift out of my old paradigms and ways of working.

Like, for example, When I was working through the course and you’re like, just say no to those things. And it’s like, but, but how do you just say no to things that you’ve always done? And that kind of feel like it’s the thing that you need to do, because that’s the thing that all the other people are doing. How do you sort of, and I, I know this might be a bit hard because you’re like, well, I’ve just never done it like that, but, but what would be your advice to people who are, you know, who’ve been in business for a long time and are wanting to create change, but don’t really know where to get started.

LEONIE: You have to think about as a logical decision. Like if you want different results from what you currently have, if you want less to work less and earn more money, you’re going to have to try something. And so you might as well just treat it like an experiment and you can just trade it like an experiment for a month or three months and or two weeks if it’s that triggering to you and see how you feel afterwards.

See like if there’s a difference in your energy level, see if you could replace that time with something else that’s more powerful and more potent. This is the whole thing about business is, is this massive experiment. Let’s see what works. Let’s try this out. Let’s see how it feels. Let’s see how it works for you. And then whether you make it permanent or not is completely up to you. You don’t have to commit to trying new things for life. Just try it for a short while and see what feels like the next right step from there.

CLARE: Yeah. So the, the masculine structures, like the, I need to email my list. Do you have like a, like, is there a frequency that you go? I know that if I don’t email them for like a year, my business is going to like, do you still have processes and structures in place?

LEONIE: Yeah, absolutely. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So like, you know, as much as like, I, you know, tend to have like the more feminine intuitive sort of approach, there’s definitely like some very masculine parts of my business. Like I have really good boundaries. I have a lot of things I say no to, I have standard operating procedures for every task in my business. Even as a person with ADHD, especially because it’s a person with ADHD and with staff who are neurodivergent, like everything needs to be documented.

So we’ve got those, those going and then we just have like non negotiables because those are things that will make a big difference to our success. It’s like, the money we’re going to create. So our mailing list is going to hear from us once a week, at least. And I have that non negotiable creative boundary of creating something for it. And that has been really helpful for me because you know, often you just don’t feel like creating something and having a good old weekly deadline, it just like kicks the writer into action. You’re like, oh shit, I better get on with that.

CLARE: I can so relate to that. If there’s not a deadline, it ain’t happening. I realized this week that someone had approached me about writing an article for like a well known magazine that I really want to be featured in. And I said, what’s the deadline? And he said, oh, there’s none. Just whenever you get it through. So it’s now been six weeks and I’m like, why didn’t he give me a deadline?

If you’re listening to the, this podcast and you can’t see the video, Leonie is really giving me the eye, that’s making me go, I need to get this thing done. Have you ever, on that note, I know I did say it was my last question, I lied. I’ve got another question. Have you ever worked with a, a mentor or a mind, like a, a mastermind or an external accountability group?

LEONIE: Yes. However, what I’ve found is I’m not like super trainable in that way. It just, I, I get the shits with things after a week or two, so I just have to keep on experimenting and playing around and, and trying. Things only work for me for maybe a week or two and then I’ve got to try something new. So like this week I’m obsessed with the Sticky Notes app as a accountability, like my own weird little accountability headline. Sometimes I need to give myself a kick up the ass and I’ll tell, like I’ll share my to do list with some of my friends and we’ll all share our to do list. Mostly for me, like, In terms of like actual coaching and things like that, usually I prefer to work with like an intuitive business, like healing session, like Kerry Rowett or Hera Boger. That to me gets such bigger results than just having a straight business mentor or even like, even therapy, like cognitive behavioral therapy. I find like doing like a goals based intuitive healing works better for me. So I stick to that.

CLARE: Yeah. I love it. It’s just figuring out what works for you and honoring, and honoring that.

Is there anything more that you want to share with the listeners before we wrap up today’s episode?

LEONIE: Yeah. I just want you to know that you are capable of ridiculous and abominable and hilarious things. Like I’ve kind of made a ridiculous amount of money just from talking shit about donkeys and unicorns on the internet and obviously making up some ridiculous rules as I go.

And I just want you to know, like, you don’t have to be like anybody else. You don’t have to market like, like anyone else. You don’t have to follow any formulas. You can just like experiment and play and try and you can have so much fun as you go. You don’t have to beat yourself up as you go. You can just keep returning to your own gifts and your own, like the joy of your own personality and sink deeper into love with it and it can be wildly profitable for you.

CLARE: What a beautiful note to end on. Thank you so, so much. I will obviously be sharing all of links in the show notes for today’s episode. I personally highly recommend her course, earn more, work less. And you know, jumping on your email list, as I said, I’m pretty new to your world, but you go really deep and really vulnerable in, in your newsletters, and it’s just a really wonderful thing to receive in your inbox each week. So make sure you go and check them out, sign up and thank you so much for agreeing to come on and sharing so openly your message with my audience. I really appreciate it.

LEONIE: I love you, Clare, and I can’t wait to get to party in person.

CLARE: I personally bought this course and took so much out of it. And guess what? It’s only 99 US dollars. I am now a proud affiliate for this course. So if you want to download it and work through the course like I have, please click on the link in the show notes for today’s episode. I am sure you will enjoy and get so much value out of it. It’s literally a steal at this price.

Thanks so much for tuning into the episode and look forward to chatting to you soon.

* Transcript created by AI – may contain errors or omissions from original podcast audio